The Third Eve

Bad Boys, Bad Boys, Whatcha Gonna Do?

October 17, 2007 · 24 Comments

I’ve known many bad boys, and several of them have been my own sons. In fact, I have to admit that most of my boys have been bad boys. Most of my friends’ boys have also been bad boys. And the sons of many of my acquaintances, relatives, and neighbors have been bad boys.

I’ve also taught a number of bad boys.

All these bad boys have taught me to believe that boys are wild and not easily tamed, and that parents and teachers who insist on taming wild, bad boys do so to the chagrin of their future wives, who complain that they’re boring, the marriage tepid, and wish that they had a real man.

My son Reed* had a heart of gold, but he was a strange boy. By the time he could talk, he had an invisible brother named Banjo. Banjo was even more wild and strange than Reed, for in the night time he opened windows, flew out of them, and had adventures that we were told about the following morning. Sometimes Banjo joined us for dinner, but he threw food and ate with his hands.

Though he has an IQ over 180, Reed doesn’t act like it sometimes. He talked about himself (and to himself) in third person for almost two years. Being Christians, we taught our children that stealing was wrong; that they should respect their parents and learn to obey rules. Reed neatly addressed the moral dilemma of wanting ice cream but having it forbidden as a breakfast food by stripping himself naked, getting the ice cream carton out of the freezer, and eating the ice cream straight from the carton. His dialogue went like this one I observed early one morning:

“Can Reed wanna hab some ice cream?”

“Yeah, Reed can wanna hab some ice cream.”

“OK.”

[Ice cream is gotten and eaten.]

“Thanks you, Reed.”

“Youse welcome, Reed.”

“Yeah.”

Reed was a little scientist, always wondering what made things work. He believed that inanimate material was alive, and screamed like a banshee when his hair was cut. He used an Exacto knife to cut open our living room sofas, convinced that a vast and explorable universe lurked inside the cushions, if only he could go there.

Because Reed was home schooled, we looked for ways to socialize our little weirdo, to gentle him and tame him. This did not work, for when enrolled in karate, he persisted in doing all the forms backward, a mirror image of the correct form, and he decried the violence required. My father worried that Reed would be unable to defend himself, he was such a gentle soul, but when Reed was only three and a Wal Mart checker was rude to my mother, Reed piped up and said, “Don’t you talk to my grandma that way! She’s good!

Reed is all grown up now, but he continues not to fit into the world and to be something of a rolling stone, gathering no moss and able to write prolifically about this. He rejects and loves God, resists every attempt at tethering, but remains powerfully bound to the family.

Another of our sons, Cedar*, was so terrible that in one week he made several elementary school teachers cry and had to be withdrawn from school. This boy would not learn to urinate in the toilet, but reserved the toilet for flushing valuables and, instead, peed into the trashcan. He also was fond of peeing outside, and more than once I went outside to find Reed, Cedar, and a few neighborhood friends balanced precariously on the fence (yes, on the fence) and peeing merrily over it and onto the neighbor’s trumpet vines.

Cedar also had a high IQ and was enrolled in the Gifted and Talented program at school, where he failed because he would not be quiet, would not keep his hands to himself, and persisted in laughing loudly and long over jokes he told himself.

He is loud. He is so loud that he could hire himself out as a bull horn. I have never known anyone so loud, except for Cedar’s birth father, who is also loud and, sadly, rather an unhappy man because nobody cared for his bad boy-ness the way Cedar’s has been cared for and protected.

My other boys were bad boys, too. They never fit in at school or the world, and I’m happy about that. They’re vibrantly alive and they can think. Several might have been labeled, but I didn’t allow that and everyone survived. When the boy without the label became too difficult for the school system, I did something about it rather than risk having my boy disappear into himself.

Among my professional experiences with boys, I have known boys who pooped in their pants until they were six years old, boys who wore their mothers to the bone, boys who cried for hours when they were infants, boys who refused to make eye contact until they were almost adults; boys who obsessively drew on things and on themselves, boys who did death-defying stunts and were repeatedly taken to the hospital; boys who, in adolescence, looked so scary that they made their younger siblings cry; boys who nearly all had invisible friends, most of whom talked funny, many of whom looked funny; all of whom had obsessions and repetetive behaviors and, in this day and age would be diagnosed as being autistic or having some syndrome but were, in fact, simply brilliant and magical and needed to be loved and allowed to simply grow up according to their own timetables and in their own ways.

Nearly every parent of every bad boy I’ve known had to remove that boy from school at some point. No bad boy thrives in public school, and few make it in private schools. These parents had to sacrifice to raise their boys. The few parents I know who wouldn’t or couldn’t make such sacrifices lost their boys in one way or another. All who had bad boys who didn’t fit in, and left them to suffer in whatever system demanded the boys change ended up with grownup bad boys who continued to not fit in. Some spent years in couch-surfing homelessness, searching for their inner lost boys. Some went off into addictions. Others became wanderers. One walked to California from the midwest. Another became an addict and later was born again. Two went into the military and became soldier leaders. A few are still trying to find themselves.

I’m no expert on boys but I do know that many boys do not fit in. Some manage their oddness by becoming leaders; others manage it by being kicked out of school; others are medicated into oblivion. I have friends whose brilliant son reacted to stressors in their family life (stressors created and denied by the parents, but obvious to nearly everyone else) by developing Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD). So many times, bright, sensitive boys develop symptoms in response to the environment–a sort of personal early warning system that functions to tell grownups to slow down. Their symptoms are labeled and ignored in the name of Education. Or Medicine. Or Science.

These parents all love their children, but nobody has told them that there are explanations for such behaviors that are not all organic or biological. Not all need drugs and labels. Some might be healed by slowing down, even stopping; others through non-traditional medicines and therapies, such as psychoanalytic work or energy work. What soon becomes clear, though, is that many of the parents of magical, bad boys simply don’t have the time to deal with the garbage. Like the schools and society, they want their boys to stop acting up so that life can be easier and they can get on with doing what they want. Their bad boys are inconvenient and demand energies the parents do not want to invest in them.

I think this is, in fact, one of the central problems for bad boys: the nature of the boy and the nature of the parents, the actual parents and society-as-parent.

It is the problem of parents who set out to have pets but had children instead, of a society that is not in the business of producing or accommodating individuals, for it can do next to nothing to help us individuate. And the priests and artists who might have helped us to individuate have been kicked out of our schools and replaced by mental health professionals who do anything but promote real, lasting mental health.

Art by Wassily Kandinsky.
*Names have been changed to protect the culpable.

Categories: Education · Parenting · Psychology

24 responses so far ↓

  • Lee's River // October 17, 2007 at 11:31 AM | Reply

    ” the problem of parents who set out to have pets but had children instead” – it’s a problem that’s been around for a long, long time, except now more and more people expect their child to be up to specifications because the child was “wanted”. As if a “wanted” child had to conform to what the parents figured they wanted i.e. an extension of themselves.

    Eve replies: Hasn’t it though? Wonder what the world would be like if all children were wanted and loved? I imagine it would still be no paradise, but I like to imagine it would be closer to one. ;o)

  • Mary Joan Koch // October 17, 2007 at 11:58 AM | Reply

    This is a fascinating post Eve. How fantastically lucky your sons were to have you as their mother. I am not an expert on “bad” boys, but my brothers and nephews have had a far rockier road to adulthood than my daughters and my nieces. Very few of them graduate from high school and then college without significant, worrisome detours and floundering. My friends with sons have worried far longer than my friends with daughters. I agree that schools often are a desperately inhospitable place for boys.

    Eve replies: Mary Joan, I just love what you wrote: “…schools often are a desperately inhospitable place for boys.” I wonder what would happen if we had more all-boy schools, as in the U.K.?

  • cerebralmum // October 17, 2007 at 8:54 PM | Reply

    What a wonderful post. And I’m now absolutely in love with your boys. If my son turns out to be a ‘bad’ boy, I will be proud and happy and it will be my job, as it is the job of any parent, to help him understand himself, to love himself, and to never let himself be reduced to a more convenient size.

    Incidentally, on the IQ side – I have many friends with IQs in that range (ie; much higher than mine) and the one strand I seem to recognise in them is that although this helps with many things, one thing it often takes away is comfort. The social lies we tell ourselves, that we tell others, the platitudes, the everything-will-be-alrights, give them no respite from the knowledge that life does not have easy answers.

    That level of awareness is very frustrating and often isolating and it isn’t surprising that they can be ‘bad’ when so much is going on and the people around them are sitting complacently in their transparent bubbles. It is a harder, but often extremely rewarding, road they have to travel to find their ease.

    Eve replies: Wow, you hit the nail on the head here. I’ve been re-visiting issues surrounding high IQ (giftedness) and will be writing about it more later, but you really described that reality perfectly. “So much is going on” just about says it, and these kids perceive it more intensely than the average.

  • charlotteotter // October 18, 2007 at 12:12 AM | Reply

    Another stunning post, Eve. Thank you so much for sharing your insights. I grew up with a brother who didn’t fit the mould – he didn’t manifest bad, but odd. After a failed suicide attempt, he is now slowly rebuilding his life. I am so relieved that my parents failed to label him (though now reading articles on adult ADHD, my mother is trying to) and let him lead at his own pace.

    Eve replies: I hope your brother makes it, and glad he survived, Charlotte. There’s so much to be said about the dark side of despair; just one more thing to write about.

  • benanite // October 18, 2007 at 10:25 AM | Reply

    Good stuff, I have also noticed that many “bad boys” are truly a lot smarter then they are given credit for. Many times they discover that they are smarter then most other people, yet are told that they have something wrong with them; that the problem with themselfs is why they have such trouble.

    If these young boys and men, were instead, allowed and informed that they were indeed smarter then the others. And not told that they have issues because they think differntly, and many times more effecintly then those that surround them. They might be a little more “tameable”. If they were told, informed, instructed on how to use there “genius” to benift others, rather then told that they themselves have issues or problems because they have an ability to see things differntly then the crowd; then these “bad boys”, I observe, would more often turn out as great helps to society, rather then “weirdos”, that are unable to coope with those who are unforutanitly less gifted.

    Eve replies: Well said, and hello, Ben. If not tame, maybe they could use their wildness and brilliance to help relieve suffering rather than cause it by internalizing or externalizing. I also think that some of the behavior of boys and young men is developmental and has to fall into the category of “this too will pass.” just loved what you wrote!

  • Smiler // October 18, 2007 at 1:23 PM | Reply

    What a great and thought provoking post! I agree that “bad boys” no doubt require more attention than a “well adjusted” child. The problem as I see nowadays is that everybody is wanting to have children, but no one seems to have the time or availability for them, no matter what their needs are.

    I’ve known women who have made it their specialty to date bad boys for the better part of their lives. Bad boys often compensate with charm what they lack in social skills and the women who love them all yearn to help heal these bad boys turned to men. And then, in some cases, some women truly do have the power to motivate some men to change their ways and “settle down”.

    Once again, you’ve inspired me to blog about… Bad Girls. That’s something I know a thing or two about myself. Btw, I’ve posted my entry about Renaissance Women. It’s a topic that’ll be worth revisiting.

    Eve replies: Hiya, Smiler. I agree that it seems to be more common for people to have children they don’t have time for. About the bad boys women are attracted to, I wonder if these men aren’t more alive in some way, even if their assocation with the ’shadow’ side is too pronounced? At least they’re alive, not slumbering as so many men are. That’s another way of looking at it, anyway. I’ll see you over at your blog!

  • AnthonyNorth // October 19, 2007 at 4:48 AM | Reply

    Excellent post. I’m the father of five boys, and I’ve noticed each one seemed to take on an aspect of me, and took it to the extreme. It’s like being in a psychological hall of mirrors. Was I really that bad?
    I think any kid that doesn’t rebel in some way does not fully come to know his own personality. The days when children grew up into little versions of their parents are rightly gone.
    Rebellion and bad behaviour is tough for the parent, but often the resultant adult is independent and a thriving member of society – and occasionally reminding them of what they used to be like is a good way to make them good to you as you get older :-)

  • Eve // October 19, 2007 at 8:19 PM | Reply

    Anthony, probably you’ve already answered, yes, you really were that bad! ;o) I find it funny that our children can be so much like us, but since they didn’t know us as teens and young adults, they think they’re quite different. We tell them that we were a lot like them; they just didn’t know us at that time.

    I think that it’s more likely that when our kids are our age, they will be much more like we are now than we or they think. That’s been what I’ve observed so far, but I still have several children to raise to adulthood. So I may be mistaken.

    Also, great comment on the function of rebellion. One hates to see it, but it does get the kid over into adulthood IF they can experience their own consequences.

  • the individual voice // October 20, 2007 at 4:42 AM | Reply

    Just stopping by to say hi. Couldn’t resist a visit to each blog on my links-list and a brief posting since I’m feeling better. As the mother of ONLY boys, I thought this was a great post It has been such a privilege to be a mother of boys and learn about their experiences of the world. And I wrote my senior thesis in college on Kandinsky’s integration of music into his painting. I still want to know how you do the magic of the gorgeous art on your site.

  • the individual voice // October 20, 2007 at 8:01 PM | Reply

    Actually, I agree with both of you. There is too much psychopathologizing of boys in schools and a readiness to medicate, but I also agree with Bub that those are pretty extreme behaviors, though the urinating outside may be a rural/urban distinction. And I happen to think Mental Health providers in the schools is a far cry better than, say, priests or rabbis for that matter. Separation of church and state anyone?

  • Eve // October 20, 2007 at 9:31 PM | Reply

    P.S. Tiv, I’m glad you’re back! I’m also excited to hear about your thesis. I didn’t know that Kandinsky used music with his art; but I love how, over the years, his paintings progressed and one can seem to see his progress toward wholeness. I just love his work.

    The secret to the art on the site is that I’m a fairly proficient user of PhotoShop and have worked as a graphic artist (among other hobbies). I use online art museums, art.com, and as much non-copyrighted art as I can find, and I copy it into PhotoShop and tweak it for size. Then I upload it to Flickr and simply copy and paste into the body of my text.

    I try to think about what I’m writing, and find art that “fits.” I’m learning a lot about different artists as I go along, although I began with familiar old favorites. For instance, I wasn’t a big Kandinsky fan and in fact was only familiar with a couple of his most famous paintings. As I looked at his work, I became fascinated with it and really enjoyed it, even though I’m not normally a big fan of modern art.

    You’ve really roused my attention with your mention of the thesis; I hope you blog a bit about your favorite parts so that those of us who are interested will be better educated.

  • Smiler // October 21, 2007 at 8:29 AM | Reply

    I’ve actually always been a fan of Kandinsky’s and, while I don’t have tonnes of artwork on my walls (ok… some), the two posters I have proudly on display are by Kandisky.

    I can’t afford his originals unfortunately, but got the posters at the Guggenheim after seeing the originals and paid a mint for the framing… all this to say that I’ve always suspected he used music because they’re both so different in tone and feel and style and colouring… just about in every way actually (but still, interestingly enough, recognizable as Kandisky’s), well you can almost FEEL the rhythm and sound that goes along with it, especially in my favourite of the two, called Black Lines (a very colourful image, interestingly enough).

    You’ve given me an idea for yet another posting Tiv, because I have things to say about that image… I’ve seen it every day for at least five years and it speaks to me every single time.

    And Eve: I could tell you had some sort of graphic knowledge – your site is gorgeous.

  • the individual voice // October 21, 2007 at 10:42 AM | Reply

    Here’s my last on Kandinsky for you two curious ladies: he had synesthesia. He experienced music as color and form and color and form as music. There was something related to spirituality in there too. He wrote a short book about this, forgot the name. You two can run with it.

  • the individual voice // October 21, 2007 at 10:43 AM | Reply

    Here’s my last on Kandinsky for you two curious ladies: he had synesthesia. He experienced music as color and form and color and form as music. There was something related to spirituality in there too. He wrote a short book about this, forgot the name. You two can run with it. Oh, and I also interned at the Guggenheim Museum one summer during college.

  • The Miseducation of Children « The Third Eve // October 21, 2007 at 5:58 PM | Reply

    [...] been writing about the disturbing trend of diagnosing young children, particularly boys, with psychiatric disorders when the very behaviors that merit a diagnosis today were considered [...]

  • cerebralmum // October 22, 2007 at 9:04 AM | Reply

    Perhaps I will turn out to be too permissive a parent, but I can’t even imagine being concerned or angered by the peeing over the fence thing. My impression was that it was sweet and funny.

    I agree that could be an incident where respect needs to be taught. I say “could”, because it is behaviour that does not necessarily arise from disrespect and seems a long way away from the intention of “destroying other people’s property” (ie; vandalism) to me. It is opportunity to teach them about what behaviour is appropriate where, before quietly sneaking back inside to laugh at the innocent enjoyment children have in their normal bodily functions, and their not-so-rebellious enjoyment of other people’s reactions. Children test boundaries in order to learn them. I just can’t bring myself to be disturbed by that. It seems quintessentially “normal” to me.

    And really, even grown men are not averse to “writing their name in the sand”, given the opportunity.

  • Tales From the Web « Charlotte’s Web // October 23, 2007 at 3:11 PM | Reply

    [...] Read more of Eve’s post here: Bad Boys, Bad Boys, Watcha Gonna Do? [...]

  • Alida // October 27, 2007 at 2:44 PM | Reply

    Thank you so much for your insight. I grew up with a sister. Sometime I look at my son’s behavior and think “that’s weird” or wonder if it’s “normal”. I felt I had nothing to compare it to. I guess the gamut of normal extents well beyond the bell curve. I thought this was so good I forwarded it to friends raising boys. Thanks again.

  • Lamberakis // November 1, 2007 at 10:58 PM | Reply

    I love bad boys. I love their weirdness and their arrogance, though in adults it has to be tempered with some self-knowledge. I’ve known at least one super-destructive, lost adult boy who nearly killed me. I’ve had women friends who had similar (and worse) experiences with their out-of-control adults boys. But I still love that feral thing bad boys have. I want to befriend it and even tame it a little, in a friendly way. At other times I want to get carried away with it.

    This man I know used to be a bad boy and was punished for it. I mean, I don’t know him very well. But I’ve observed him. He seems in pain sometimes. It’s subtle. He’s very composed. He can be cutting, but there’s a goodness at the core. It’s like a plant reaching for sunlight maybe, twisting and contorting itself to reach a better place. That’s the sense I get from him.

  • Lamberakis // November 1, 2007 at 10:59 PM | Reply

    …tempered with self-knowledge and kindness.

  • bluemilk // March 14, 2008 at 6:01 PM | Reply

    Thought-provoking post. I have a bad boy nephew. He is only 8 years old but has been on strong medication since he was 4. To me he has always seemed to be a normal, but lively little kid who doesn’t get enough to occupy himself with. Just recently I heard his mother say that she was putting him back on medication because they couldn’t stand his beheviour without it, I had not noticed a single difference in his behaviour – led me to really wonder about the placebo effect of the medication ON HIS PARENTS.

  • bluemilk // March 14, 2008 at 6:07 PM | Reply

    Sorry about the multitude of errors in that comment dragging your lovely page down.. wrote that comment in rather a hurry with my daughter nagging me for an avocado.

  • Kari // October 10, 2008 at 11:14 AM | Reply

    I was searching for information on “bad boys” and came across this post. I am withdrawing my own bad boy from Catholic school this week. His main offense is making faces at the other children for which he is in constant “time outs”. After speaking to the teacher I realized he is just going to run circles around her. If she wants to engage in a power struggle, he is going to win.

    Your post made me cry because I hate to see my own child labled and his brilliance lost.

  • Eve // October 10, 2008 at 5:43 PM | Reply

    Kari, I wrote not too long ago about my run-in with my daughter’s teacher at our parochial school. I’m seeing that sometimes it isn’t about the whole school, sometimes it’s about the mix of the teacher and the child. If the teacher can’t handle the child, then we must find someone who can.

    I recently moved my daughter and she’s doing great, by the way. So I wish you the best of luck.

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